The Often-Overlooked Truth About Immigration

Reader Comments
Back to blog

Andrew of CA - I am gratified to see an Illegal Immigrant supporter actually pays attention to the BLS Unemployment reports! I hate to do it but I have to say that you are not looking at ALL the data before blowing off the effect that Illegal Immigrants have on the U.S. Worker. Try consulting chart 26 at ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/special.requests/lf/aat26.txt or other similar charts and comparing the data to the Pew Center Data that tells where Illegal Immigrants are working and you will see that the vast majority of the unemployed are in the same industries as are Illegal Immigrants. So to claim that "Jobs are not exchangeable and a simple comparison of employed illegal immigrants and unemployed Americans is almost irrelevant" does not hold up when one looks at the detailed statistics. In fact, the data clearly states that Illegal Immigrants directly compete with the majority of our unemployed for jobs. And it is only those who want to keep using that hackneyed line "Illegal Immigrants take jobs that Americans will not do" that refuse to see the facts.

Norski of MN 8:59PM September 12, 2008

I should have made this clearer. I think the US immigration law needs to be changed to reflect the way people live their lives as Hernando de Soto recommends.
And Norski, I don't think there's much substance to your comment that "... if the Illegal Immigrant were not working, a U.S. Citizen would be." Jobs are not exchangeable, and a simple comparison of the number of employed legal immigrants and unemployed Americans is almost irrelevant. By your logic you could also argue that 16-19 year olds are displacing adult workers, since (for whites for instance) there are 4.6 million young workers employed and there are 5.8 million adult workers unemployed (source: http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t02.htm). So we should probably not allow young Americans to hold jobs either right? Comparing these numbers for any two groups is a meaningless exercise.

Andrew of CA 1:53PM September 12, 2008

How can we truly have free trade until we have free trade in labor? With the proper worker protections in place we could allow people to come and go legally in order to meet the needs of a rapidly shifting and dynamic economy. We long ago tore down the barriers to the free flow of capital across borders so why not for labor?
And Luther, we still lead the world in technological innovation (for now). Just because high tech goods aren't produced here doesn't mean those ideas weren't generated here. You seem to be missing the point.

Andrew of CA 1:11PM September 12, 2008

So many crimes are happening across America, that usually do not warrant any national press report. Thousands have been needless caused under the sheltering blanket of 'SANCTUARY CITIES' The question is, has this been going on for decades? That only because we have the Internet, instant communication that everybody knows almost immediately? Or is it because the masses of illegal people entering this nation, without being screened has brought with them a third world mentality?
If it wasn't for Independent Journalists like Lou Dobbs of CNN or O'Reilly from FOX, Glenn Beck, as the population of activists Americans would forever remain in the dark. Pro-immigrant zealots don't like it, because the average citizen or legal resident has a say in this explosive issue. Regular citizens have become the first line of defense of corrupt politicians and the special interest lobby, that remain in collusion with far-left (9th district court) judges and extremist groups which border on tyranny.
We have the violent street gangs protected by 'Sanctuary cities' like Los Angeles. Although thousands have died under the masquerade of Sanctuary city policies. Mayor Villigrossa of Los Angeles, followed closely by Mayor Newsom of San Francisco have allowed the obscene police law to propagate. Even as a speak three lives were taken in Aurora, Colorado by another illegal alien thanks to Mayor John Hickenlooper’s. Yet another two police officers killed in cold blood, by another illegal alien who escaped to Mexico. In Texas Officer Rodney Johnson was gunned down after making a routine traffic stop and arrest. Houston Police Officer Gary Gryder was struck and killed by a driver. the shooting death of Fort Myers police officer Andrew Widman. These deaths should never have happened, if it wasn't for tainted politicians intentionally subverting the laws. These disturbing deaths are ricocheting around the Internet, but not in the liberalized national media. Go to the under mentioned websites below and GOOGLE the widespread carnage.
Then we have honest, pro-American Mayors like Lou Barletta of Hazleton and the Governor Don Carcieri fighting for there citizens, but demonized by anti-sovereignty groups like the ACLU, Southern Poverty League zealots and the US Chamber of Commerce. There is a anti-illegal war that is about to boil over as legal Americans finally realize the extent of the occupation. It's US, against THEM? Them being the corrupt politicians who genuflect to the corporate world, who without any conscious
Then Mayor Newsom, Mayor Villigrossa who must be held accountable for the deaths of 3 Bolgna family members, Jamiel Shaw under the obnoxious 'Sanctuary City' laws by illegal gang member filth.
If we enact the Federal SAVE ACT (H.R.4088) enforcement only law. Millions of illegal aliens will leave by self-deportation. ATTRITION! No job, they will leave of their own accord. TRUE FACTS AT NUMBERSUSA, JUDICIAL WATCH

Brittanicus of IN 9:08PM September 11, 2008

Brent of MA - Your claim about what Illegal Immigrants contribute forgets one hugely important fact. Illegal Immigrants displace U.S. workers.
In the August 2008 Federal USBLS Unemployment Report, Chart A-1, two categories of unemployment are reported. The first is the one publicized on the news. It is 6.1% or 9.4 million people unemployed. The second is rarely reported in the news and includes those the government designates as “Not in Labor Force: Persons Who Currently Want a Job”. This group currently numbers 4.8 million. So including ALL of our unemployed who want to work we now have 14.2 million out of work U.S. Citizens and Legal Residents, which is an effective 8.9% unemployment rate. Meanwhile the most recent reports from the Pew Center and the Social Security Administration estimate there are about 7.2 million jobs currently held by Illegal Immigrants who have no legal standing to hold those jobs. So for every working Illegal Immigrant we have two unemployed Citizens and Legal Residents. And if you review the history of these numbers during the Bush or Clinton Presidencies there have always been significantly more unemployed than there have been estimated working Illegal Immigrants. So in fact, if the Illegal Immigrant were not working, a U.S. Citizen would be. So really there is no net economic gain.
Worse, per the statistics above we effectively pay two people to do one job. We pay Illegal Immigrant to work and we pay Unemployment and Welfare to the U.S. Citizen that the Illegal Immigrant caused to be unemployed. Per U.S. Gov. Statistics unemployment pays the equivalent of $7.00 to $13.00 per hour depending on State ($14,000 and $26,000 per year). Add in an average of about $2,700 welfare payments, multiply by 7.2 million, then assume that only two thirds of the unemployed actually get this and the net cost is $100 billion per year or $700 per year to each working American in higher taxes.
And with twice as many Unemployed as we have working Illegal Immigrants the amount of money working Illegal Immigrants contribute to Social Security and Tax collections pales in comparison to that paid to Americans who are not working thanks to Illegal Immigrants. A recent study placed the Tax and Social Security contributions of Illegal Immigrants at only $9 billion.
Per a recent study by George Borjas of Harvard, Illegal Immigrants have depressed wages by 8% in the unskilled and craft labor market - construction, material handling, farm labor, food processing, cleaning, etc. Per the Pew Center, Illegal Immigrants make up less than 20% of the workforce across all these professions. Therefore we have about 29 million Americans ((7.2 million/20%)-7.2 million) who have seen their wages fall by 8% or about $2000+ per year assuming their wages average $25,000 per year. This amounts to a $58 billion loss in spending power for our lowest paid hard working fellow Citizens. In fact this is truly a case of causing more harm than good.

Norski of MN 5:36PM September 11, 2008

Jim of TX writes: "On the other hand an uneducated illegal immigrant that has come across the rio grande river in the middle of the night and then tries to make a living as a day laborer, is a huge drain on our society, and is largely responsible for our out of control medical costs, court costs, jail cost, welfare costs etc etc etc"
Jim, with respect to some of them you are right; but with many you are not. First, there is a common misconception that the illegals entered illegally. Half did, half entered legally as tourists or students and overstayed. Another common misconception is that 12 million crossed the rio grande. About 50% - 60% are from Mexico, the rest from all over the world. There is a GAO study on this, with statistics.
But on to your point -- that uneducated people are responsible for our out of control medical, court, jail, welfare (and you left out school) costs. That is true to some degree. Ask the governors of our border states, and just go look at the schools in the border districts; they are struggling. However, it is not true across the board that the illegals are a burden and not carrying their share. Many illegals aren't paid in cash under the table-- they are using a friend's or relative's Social Security number. Taxes are withheld, including Social Security taxes. A recent study determined that illegal aliens using other people's SSN's have paid *billions* into the Social Security system. They are bailing out the baby-boomers. There are also studies by governors of several states that take a more fairminded approach to the question of whether the aliens are only a burden. Sure, many of them are, that's plain to see. However, in some states (e.g. New Mexico) tax revenues are raised mostly by sales taxes, and illegals pay these as much as legals do, every time they go to the grocery store, fill a gas tank, etc. So it is quite incorrect to say that they aren't carrying their share of the load. I am not encouraging opening the floodgates. I'm just trying to be fairminded about the whole question.

brent of MA 4:38PM September 11, 2008

In the course of my business I have had occasion to hear hundreds of small American employers state why they want a foreign worker. These have been high-tech firms with a patented product as well as all manner of professionals--architects, software firms, college research programs. They haven't said "I want this foreign person because he/she is the cheapest". They've said over and over "I need this person because he/she is the best." Americans who oppose more H-1Bs and green cards have not talked to enough American-owned technology companies and American university research facilities. Over and over I hear "I *must* have this person, he/she is my right arm." Do a survey of such organizations and you will find that at the heart of many of them (maybe most) are foreign researchers, foreign kids with US degrees. That's right--*immigrants* are major contributors to America's cutting edge technology, and America gets the credit. To the unbelievers posting here, just look at the nationalities on these patent applications, or call up your local university and ask. Ask how important are the contributions to American competitiveness made by foreign grad students on J visas, by recent grads with US degrees and H-1B visas. If we send them home, if we reduce their numbers, if we tighten up on these visas--we are shooting ourselves in the foot. Don't believe statistics--ask the American owners of the firms (if they aren't afraid to answer; such a horrific fear of the subject has arisen in this country due to the anti-immigrant sentiment). It's the equivalent of kids from America's poor neighborhoods who see that sports is a way out of poverty. They don't just become good athletes; they become amazing. It's the same way for these kids who come over here as foreign students and researchers. Some of them want to take their knowledge back to their homeland, and some want to stay here. Those who want to stay soon learn that the path to a green card is excellence. They do not take living in America for granted. Do you and I? Every day. But these young people who see what they can accomplish here, strive to get noticed and very often work or study harder than their US peers. It is flat-out tragic that some of the voices that claim to be helping American businesses by keeping foreign workers out, are creating a catastrophe.
Now, as to the uneducated (and generally very hard working) immigrants who want to stay. First, the concerns about overpopulation are legitimate, and there have to be limits. But if some of the 12 million (e.g. non-criminals) are given the right to live here for the rest of their lives, make it at a price: They can never become US citizens, and other than their minor kids they can never sponsor relatives for visas. If they want to become US citizens and sponsor relatives, then go home and get in line and wait their turn (10-20 years, too long) but if they want to cut in front of the line maybe they should get green cards and that's it.

Brent in Lowell of MA 6:26AM September 11, 2008

Thanks Native American, for unmasking ths loon from the Cato Institute. The Cato Institute is an organziation for open borders loons. They see people as interchangeable economic units, so to them, an illiterate peasant from Mexico is the exact same interchangeable economic unit as a native-born American software engineer with a PhD. They pretend to be "libertarian" but they get real antsy whenever you ask them to pony up for the "free" social services and infrastructure that are used by the Third World hordes they want to import into our country. Basically they just want cheap labor while at the same time, sucker middle-class Americans into subsidizing their cheap labor with our tax dollars.

MaryJ of CA 11:21PM September 10, 2008

The IRS estimates that in 2009 a total of 250 million tax returns will be filed. I would be interested in hearing those who claim immigration law is impossible to enforce explain why we can successfully enforce the law governing the filing of 250 million tax returns but not enforce the law that was supposed to stop the estimated 12 million Illegal Immigrants from being in this country. By their logic, all who do not file a tax return should be given a free pass because after all, enforcement is just too hard beause there are so many, right?

Norski of MN 6:43PM September 10, 2008

Daniel Griswold weaves a great premise. Too bad it is all based in philosophy. He obviously does not have an economic understanding as to where the current immigration limits come from and why those who illegally by-pass the limits are a problem. In the last 20 years, after our economy stabilized at 67% of our population seeking employment, we have only been able to create an average of 1.66 million new jobs per year. This limit was not reached because of limits on Immigration. It exists because of the limited ability for our economy to grow the Capital that creates jobs.
During the last 20 years the number Americans unemployed never fell below 9 million if you include “discouraged workers”(economic term for people who want to work but are not included in the regular unemployment figures) and today stands at 14.2 million. If jobs were actually going unfilled this would not be so.
If one assumes that the current U.S. Fertility Rate of 2.1 children per woman were to continue and one realizes that with the average number of workers hitting retirement each year at 2.5 million versus an average of 3.0 million new young Americans entering the workforce each year we need to have one half million new jobs each year just for our native born young folks. So at best we could sustain about 1.16 million new Legal Immigrants per year, which is what we already accept.
It has been proven again and again historically that Capital cannot expand jobs as fast as immigrants can come to the U.S. Back in 1910 towards the end of the last great migration to the U.S., unemployment for unskilled workers reached 32% nationwide, which is why we try to limit the number of new immigrants we admit today.
Ignoring those people that come into the U.S. without permission above our current caps (Illegal Immigrants) throws Citizens out of work. Why Citizens? Because it has also been proven Illegal Immigrants freely accept wages below that which a fairly treated Citizen needs to survive. And current statistics support that with 14.2 million Citizens and Legal Residents not able to find work (U.S.B.L.S. data) versus 7.2 million working Illegal Immigrants (Pew Center data) and a current 20% unemployment rate for those between the ages of 18 and 20 (mostly unskilled and semi1skilled workers).
That is the no win choice that we face. Take in Illegal Immigrants who came in excess of our reasonably established limits and see our Citizens go unemployed or deport Illegal Immigrants and preserve our neighbor’s jobs. And do not think that Illegal Immigrants “do the jobs we will not do”. A Pew study "estimated that illegal immigrants fill a quarter of all agricultural jobs, 17 percent of office and house cleaning positions, 14 percent of construction jobs and 12 percent in food preparation." That means that 75 percent of agricultural jobs, 83 percent of office and house cleaning jobs, 86 percent of construction jobs and 88 percent of food preparation jobs are done by Americans.

Norski of MN 2:55PM September 10, 2008